Considering that many of the anti's reside within these communities, it would seem conflicting to expect many would reside in this group or in the zoo community in general. On the other hand, I consider zoophilia to be a social justice issue on our end.
Also, I've seen quite a bit of misogyny within the community, especially in zoo forums where the mods are more lenient about personal attacks and negative attitudes.
Being a female-bodied, non-binary trans person who is also disabled and a PoC, I've experience oppressive situations other than for being zoo all of my life. I fight for the queer community, PoC community, and other communities that are more privileged than the zoo community, as well as the zoo community. Yet the only zoos I find that are into social justice issues are on tumblr and are few and far between.
Please let me know I am not the only one who is disheartened and feeling lonely because of this?
You will be hard pressed to find anyone. It's not that I have a problem; I just don't care. First, I'm here for the animals. Humans don't appeal to me at all. Second, many in the "normal" sexual orientations (gay, bi, trans*) are heavily anti-zoophilia (or anti-bestiality, whatever).
You should be lucky that religious zealots aren't lynching people that much. People are psychos. (And hence my sexual orientation.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rh6qqsmxNs
I have considered expanding my interests that way for a while, but then what does that actually mean, to be "into" it? What am I supposed to actually do other than inform myself?
Some people don't make any effort to consider social issues. Some people just aren't very politically minded. Educating yourself is something, it certainly isn't nothing. That's exactly how I got started was educating myself after learning about the injustices that people in each of these communities I belonged to have to go through.
I'm not saying anyone has to be super political and spend all their time and effort on these sorts of things, but being aware an supportive is helpful.
I regularly talk about it, less so recently.
I have regularly spoken up on forums regarding misogyny, I've fought for gay rights for 20 years. Many zoos, as most people, have very small worlds and honestly being zoo is scary enough for most.
Out of curiosity, do you find a lot of people in social justice circles fight for things that don't benifit thenselves? They will play lip service to other folks issues but not really do more.
I think because oppression is so widespread, it is very very difficult for most people to be involved in more than 1 issue at a time because there are so many and many people are too busy with work, education and family.
So to answer your question, it's actually pretty rare to see someone fighting for more than one issue, but it is increasing over the years I have noticed. "Intersectional feminism" is becoming more and more common because we are all starting to realize that it isn't just "I" in the big picture of oppression, it's all of us and we all benefit from helping each other.
In the last 5 years or so the number of women being persecuted through the legal system (and publicly shamed) for seeking or performing sexual activity with animals has increased. I could easily cite you half a dozen examples perhaps a score or so (these being examples where no there is no victimization of anyone either human or animal).
The anger and punishment directed at these women for the totally harmless and essentially private expression of their individual sexuality terrifies me. The women I am thinking of have harmed absolutely nobody, yet they are subject to terrible persecution for "deviating" from social sexual norms.
To me this reminds me of all the other forms of sexual persecution and sexual hatred directed against women through institutional forms for the past few hundred years - think the Magdalene laundries, for example.
I simply don't understand why the right of sexual self-determination does not extend to women engaging in harmless sexual activity with animals. I really think therefore, that the right for women to have sex with animals is an absolute test case for women's rights and feminism more generally. Why are the feminists so silent on the subject?
It upsets me to see people being legally persecuted for sexual interest in animals, I genuinely see it as state sanctioned violence directed at the private lives of innocent women.
I'm absolutely a feminist and a zoophile. I don't really know an awful lot about social justice issues, since I'm not involved with any of the communities where they tend to be discussed, but at a glance, I'd say that they seem like causes I'd support.
I think social justice things get a bit of a bad rap because, as with any group, there are always people who hold extreme views and who tend to end up falsely representing the community. I've heard SO much about "feminazis" who want to kill all men, but I've never actually met one. All the feminists I've talked to have been reasonable, decent people, and the same goes for people involved in social justice issues.
I think the lack of zoos who are openly interested in social justice and other such things may just be a consequence of people thinking "hell, I have enough problems of my own without worrying about other people," which you can't really blame them too harshly for. Add to that the fear of being attacked for your zoosexuality by people who in all other respects you would consider "on the same side" and it's easy to see why people who're visibly into social justice may keep quiet about the zoophilia.
A quick look through the "zoophilia" tag on tumblr is enough to tell you that the vast majority of people using it (once you've filtered out all the porn) are violently opposed to it and seemingly have no interest whatsoever in a discourse, which isn't going to do much to endear them to zoophiles who might otherwise be interested in what they have to say. I guess the bottom line is that just because you're into social justice, doesn't mean you're not also a jerk to certain people who really don't deserve it :P
Hm. Makes me wonder, what would happen if some zoos went round supporting social justice issues while simultaneously announcing they were zoos?
For example, if someone says "It doesn't count as rape if they are drunk", responding "I have higher standards of consent than you and I'm a zoophile.". Let people know we're worth caring about.
No idea if it's a good idea, I'm not really a people person.
I think the "not really a people person" thing is one of the main reasons there's not a lot of overlap between zoophiles and social justice types. There is a bit of a tendency among zoophiles to be somewhat misanthropic or at the least not particularly interested in humans.
As for bringing up zoophilia in the context of social justice, it might feel a little like you're hijacking the conversation for your own ends. If the conversation at hand isn't about zoophilia, crowbarring in a reference to it feels a little self-serving and like you're more interested in pushing your own agenda than addressing the current topic. I think it's absolutely worth talking about it, and being open and honest about it, but I don't think it needs to be propagandized, since that could well backfire.
To be honest, I'm a little bitter towards the whole LGBT conglomeration. It's unreasonable, I know, but I would have an extremely hard time actively supporting communities that have significantly more public support than zoos do when those communities wouldn't dare touch us with a ten-foot pole.
On top of that, I have a very hard time trusting people who are into social justice issues. It'd be great if when I found out someone was a member of those communities I could assume they were a relatively open-minded, compassionate, and trustworthy person, but if anything I've had the opposite experience. A good number of people aligned with those issues have gone of their way to insult and demean me.
My fear is that the current social justice movement isn't actually overwhelmingly a collection of people who're willing to fight for those who are oppressed as much as they're just a group who've taken to heart the idea that LGBT/PoC people are cool and deserve better (Which is true, but it'd be best if that conclusion had been reached through critical thought rather than just parroting the ideas over and over until they can't help but believe they're true). Us zoos didn't make it onto the boat this time around.
I wish everyone the best, but I'm not going to put effort towards helping other groups when they refuse to even give us a seat at the table, let alone take the time to consider the fact that we might not be horrible monsters.
The thing is, I once thought that way too, even being a part of that community myself. The problem with feeling bitter toward the bad apples of any particular group is it divides people further instead of bringing them closer together to get serious issues resolved because you take the worst people from the group and then generalize the entire group based on a few bad apples.
Do you agree with what every claimed zoophile/zoosexual does or thinks just because they are zoo? Of course not, so why should any other group be any different? I have definitely met my fair share of assholes who claimed to be zoo, yet my view of the entire zoo community is not tarnished. I fight and I care because I want to help people who cannot help themselves by themselves and I believe in fair and equal treatment for everyone, it doesn't mean I have to like or agree with everyone who claims to be a part of said particular group.
I know of plenty of zoos who are disgusting, abusive assholes-- and I know plenty of zoos who are amazing people. I don't judge zoos before I've gotten to know them, because I don't know which kind they're going to turn out to be.
I've had the experience of being harassed, insulted, and belittled by the bad apples of the social justice crowd. And when I've tried to chat with the presumably cool, non-bad apples... they're ambivalent at best. There're only so many times I can hear 'I respect you and your preferences, but please don't act on them so you don't hurt any animals' before I just don't want anything to do with that group of people anymore.
I don't blame you. It's good to get away from it if it stresses you out too much.
This me sad. I am a vegetarian and believe strongly in kindness to animals, but most of them will call me a monster for being interested in animals in this way while they eat meat made from animals killed by humans and raised in horrible conditions :(
I would think members of one fringe group would go out of their way to demean members of another fringe group as a way to legitimize their own. Not saying it's right or correct, just but that this is probably the reasoning. They want their group to be accepted, so try to conform to the standards of those people they want acceptance from.
ok i had to actually go and look up exactly what misogyny was:
Misogyny (/mɪˈsɒdʒɪni/) is the hatred or dislike of women or girls. Misogyny can be manifested in numerous ways, including sexual discrimination, denigration of women, violence against women, and sexual objectification of women.
you're shitting me. you got any examples?
Not offhand. I haven't visited or taken part of a zoo community other than this one and tumblr, in a few years, but that is one of the main reasons why I left them.
The four zoo women who I know personally will not travel in zoo spaces because they are simply not safe. I've seen what happens to them when it because known they aren't men. Have you tried asking a female zoo about this? Certain zoos keep claiming to not be interested in women, but their colours change when they sniff one. I was once told "I only want to marry them for the cover." I will say that it is no different than any other sexual forum though. So zoos aren't any different along that way.
Count me out. I dislike some of the feminism of today and support equality for all instead. Admittedly, I don't like women in particular, I have a neutral stance if you so will and treat them with decorum in public as I treat all fellow humans. Just yesterday e.g. helped a woman with a buggy over the subway stairs, bugger me if I could remember what she looked like - yet I really like horses, I remember many horses I met. Or do mares count in that context then? ;)
I am disappointed with the LGBT thing. Too often have I read - even as open admissions - opinions from there that they need to burn us figuratively as sacrificial offering to the conservatives. It's like they stopped caring that the bible and moral codes are completely arbitrarily cherry-picked as soon as they managed to escape the consequences of that themselves. Now quickly bolt that hatch shut, so it is ok, and nothing can come in any longer, and therefore they can be in the same room as the conservatives. Is that fine? Also with you rightwing true reds in the back?
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I sadly think I have to agree with the sentiment that LGBT groups aren't really friendly to the idea of LGBTZ.
Exhibits:
https://np.reddit.com/r/lgbt/search?q=bestiality&restrict_sr=on
https://np.reddit.com/r/ainbow/search?q=bestiality&restrict_sr=on
The thing is, as I don't represent or speak for all zoos, the same goes for people within the LGBT/queer community. The us VS. them mentality isn't a very rational one when you really look at it and it helps no one to think this way and in fact divides people further. I personally think we need to salvage any chance to not divide us as it will only benefit us in the future. I think we need to challenge people's ideas in a manner in which they don't feel attacked.
When you say everyone from the LGBT/queer community is against us, that would have to include me as well, as I am transgender and pansexual. How could I be against myself as I am also zoo? One can participate in multiple communities.
Well, of course not everyone, just in general.
I actually think I have to withdraw my opinion. I thought I had seen overwhelming opposition, but after taking a little time to read through these threads again I have seen some very ignorant comments, but I have also seen a lot of civil discussion. The only problem I actually see is these discussions dying whenever they're about to lead to any conclusions.
I consider myself to be a bit pansexual too, but I don't have much contact to these communities, I just follow them and maybe join a few online discussions here or there. I have also considered to be more active there and be one more, but I don't really feel the desire to do so, I don't really know why..
I have one "friend" who is very much into social justice (who doesn't know I'm a zoo, which is certainly for the best), who spends much of his time berating me on how I should take a more active role against social injustices, and how I supposedly have absolutely no comprehension of what it feels like to be discriminated against. Yeah, I'm sure.
While I agree with much of what he says in principle, a mixture of contempt for humankind and having enough of my own issues to deal with means that I have no desire to push for the advancements of rights in other minorities. Of course, I do my best to treat everyone with respect and remain impartial and nonjudgemental, and for me, that's enough.
Edit: Mod moment; there's no need to be downvoting this. It's a good submission that in no way violates the sidebar rules. Also, I can assure you that discriminatory or bigoted comments of any nature will be removed by me for as long as I mod here. I cannot speak for other communities.
I think I count as feminist, because I see no fundamental difference between the minds and personalities of men and women. (Minds and personalities being the only things I think count for judging the worth of a person). That said, I wish I fought harder for women's rights.
I have never really understood why people could be negative towards trans, and I regard trans-phobic people the same way I regard people who think epilepsy is "just attention seeking". The rest of LGBT… in my region, the battle seems to be won. Nothing left to fight for.
I had to look up "PoC". I wish I could say I was as good on this count as the last two, but although I will sign petitions against racism and be inclusive where I can, I'm sorry to say I still get scared when someone is darker than roughly this shade. I recognise it's a problem and I intend to work on it. I wish I could say I was better than this, but that would be a lie.
I think Muslim women should be allowed to wear a veil while giving evidence in court. Neither the religion nor any of their face/hair coverings worry me. I support most other (local-)minority faiths too: Pagan, Buddhist, Sikh, etc.
I know very little about what it's like to be disabled, but when there is something I know I can do to make the world better, I do try to do it.
The kink/BDSM community is the only social-justice minority group I can't bring myself to support. I tried exploring it for a while, but left when I realised it was rejecting zoophilia.
I almost left fetlife because of the negativity in the kink community surrounding zoos. But it's like that with every other minority community because they see us as dragging them down by association. I'm way too kinky to give up on it entirely though, I just pick and choose wisely who I let into my social circle and if no one likes the fact that I'm zoo in any community, well then I save myself the headache of being surrounded with their bigotry by not paying them any attention unless it is necessary to keep the peace and I have no other choice but to indulge social graces.
There are over 7 billion people on this planet, we will drive ourselves mad if we try to please everyone by conforming to their ideals.
Yeah, most of my friends that are feminists and SJWs, I wouldn't dare tell them about this part of me. I like how they pride themselves on being so open-minded.
That being said, I am a feminist and a lazy SJW.