EDIT: I'm logging out for the day. I may return tomorrow.
EDIT: this first paragraph was added for /r/SuicideWatch
I do not think I am at immediate risk for committing suicide, but I'm not on a good path, and this is the only sizable subreddit that I thought might listen, or at least provide me with an outlet. I have spent most of today writing this very carefully, trying to convey things that I've never even written down before. I'm sorry it's so long.
This is something that's been simmering for a long time. I feel like I finally need to write about it and express it, otherwise I worry I'll go insane.
For some time I've been aware that I'm a zoophile, that I feel a sexual attraction to certain non-human animals.
Before I go any further, I want to make clear that I've never done anything to any animal. Obviously you don't need to have sex with someone to know that you feel lust for them. It's the same here.
You should also know that it's not within someone's power to control what they find attractive. I can control my actions, but not my attractions. From what I've read, heard, and experienced, suppressing sexual desire doesn't work. I've had to accept it, but choose not to act on it.
It also bares mentioning that I'm also attracted to humans, so I potentially have an outlet for my sexuality, though I'm a virgin and haven't been in a relationship (my social skills aren't the best).
I've seen videos and images of bestiality. I can't tell much from short videos and snippets. Sometimes the animals look comfortable and fine, and in other cases they appear to be being raped. As soon as I get an inkling that it's bad, I turn off the video. I've lurked the zoophile “communities” (if you can call them that) and read articles and opinion pieces about zoophilia.
It seems to me as though, since animals ARE naturally sexual, we should be able to easily make a distinction between an animal having sex and an animal being raped, be it by another animal or a human, but many people don't.
Some of the sites I've found that host zoo porn (hosted in foreign countries, I'm guessing) don't appear to cater to zoophiles at all. In fact, I'd wager they cater to straight men who want to see WOMEN being fucked by animals. I'm not interested in those videos. There are many of them, and they have the cookie-cutter aesthetic of professionally-produced porn, so I'm certain these women are being paid, and likely aren't zoophiles themselves. In many cases, the male animals are clearly unhappy and struggling.
I've found some videos where everything seems fine, the animals seem to be comfortable, they clearly aren't drugged or restrained, their tails are wagging and they're showing clear and unambiguous affection for the person they're having sex with, but there are so many horrible videos and images in between. For me, the differences between these are like the differences between night and day, like the differences between sex and rape among humans. The fact that people draw no distinction between them, that these images and videos are forced to share the same space as videos depicting blatant abuse, is horribly disturbing to me.
Some of the worst, creepiest shit I've read came from animal breeders and farmers, who for all I know might be sadistic zoophiles themselves, writing candidly about forcing animals to mate by any means legal, squeezing as many progeny out of females as possible for profit, to sell to strangers or slaughter for food. What they do is legal and supported by society. We've all probably participated in this indirectly at some point, and enjoyed the fruit of it. People who argue that this ought be illegal are branded as weirdos and extremists, but even the most extreme protesters rarely have any regard for basic aspects of what might constitute a healthy sex-life for an animal, like the capacity to choose one's partner. OF COURSE animals possess sexual preferences. It's no wonder we don't have any sort of deep or meaningful understanding of zoophilia, when culturally we don't have any deep or meaningful understanding of non-human sexuality in general.
There was a period toward the beginning of this when I was in denial. There's one particular moment, not a particularly special one, but I remember it vividly, as I was leaving a restaurant bathroom. Earlier that day, I'd viewed videos of bestiality. In that moment, I thought to myself “I'm not actually a zoophile.” I honestly believed that at that moment. I don't know what sort of mental gymnastics I went through to conclude that. It was a state of honest, wholesale denial, the mechanisms behind which I can't describe.
On rare occasions, I find something written by a zoophile posted to a social media site which resonates with me. In it, I see expressed the familiar desperate desire to stave off self-loathing, to forge an identity for oneself that defies society's expectations. They say all the things I'm thinking but am too cowardly to say. In response to these posts is an ocean of hate: “disgusting,” “gross,” “sick,” “fucking kill yourself,” and every comment feels like it's directed at me.
When people are so hateful toward a zoophile for merely trying to express their thoughts and feelings, I wonder what they're expecting to happen. Are they expecting us to disappear? Are they expecting us to stop being zoophiles? Do they think shame, fear and imposed silence will make us more likely to handle our urges responsibly? I sincerely doubt that denial, sexual repression, and anxiety is a recipe for a responsible and sane person. Most likely, they just don't care; they know they don't like it, and they feel like they have to pitch in SOMEHOW to combat this terrible thing, but beyond that they don't care what becomes of us.
I want to be responsible, I want to do no harm, and that would be so much easier if only I could TALK OPENLY about it at all. I can barely express these ideas to myself, or to complete strangers on the internet, forget about anyone I actually know, or even a therapist.
I can't talk about this with anyone of consequence. If I did, my friends would leave me. Hell, I would probably leave me if I were in their place, goodness knows I'm a coward. My parents love me, I know they'd stand by me, try to help me, and that makes it so much worse, it would hurt them so, so much. My mother would cry. They, above all others, can never know. I'm walled in.
Please help me.
EDIT: since originally posting this in suicide watch, the topic has shifted a little. You can read the comments there: https://www.reddit.com/r/SuicideWatch/comments/3ezwpe/im_a_zoophile/
Yeah, it sucks. You feel powerless. You feel angry. Maybe, scared?
I am not a psychologist, but I can empathy with you. You must acknowledge your emotions. They are real. You must also realize that humans are animals (in the technical sense). We have desires, feelings, urges. Civilization tries to contain these urges, but they are still there.
###You may or may not be a zoophile
I don't know if you are young or not, but you may have to go through a period of self-discovery.
###You don't have to be a superhero
Harry Browne stated, "THE UTOPIA TRAP is the belief that you must create better conditions in society before you can be free." I seriously believe that zoophilia and others within that categories won't have rights or be taken seriously for some time. You don't to wait for a better world to be happy.
###What should you do right now?
Prioritize. Right now, survival is your highest priority. I don't want anything to happen to you. If you are young, (I'm sorry) living with your parents may be the best for you.
Plan. What do you want to do? What can you do? Do you have a source of income (a job, investments)?
Work on improving yourself. As a zoophile you tend to know a lot about animals. Promote animal welfare. Find a hobby.
###There are others out there
Nice, sane people. You just have to be careful. The furry fandom IS NOT about zoophilia; however, some naturally gravitate towards it. There's also the German group.
###Therapists may not help or understand
After I was caught with my family's dog, my parents sent me to a therapist. Though I didn't mention it (my mother told me I didn't have to), I tried to hint at it at first. Mind you, this wasn't a doctor. She was more like a nurse. She didn't really care about my situation. The result from it was that she urged me to go to college. You do not want to appear like you are crazy. It is not good. You are just different.
I hope you stay in the subreddit (as long as it is safe) and talk. Remember, no names or any other identifying information.
Thank you. This is probably the most useful reply I've gotten. I think your "what should you do now?" section was particularly relevant, and is very similar to what I've been thinking myself.
EDIT: the bit about not being a superhero was also helpful. Wanted to let you know.
Glad to hear for ya.
As for the haters out there, I've sort of pushed them out of my mind. I don't tell people, but I also don't let their comments bother me.
Some day, (after dealing with my financial problems) I would love to go hiking and vagabonding with a german shephard and see exotic places. I'm not the kind of guy that wants to settle down and get married.
I originally discovered my sexuality around 10 or so. My grandparents had a female rough collie (Lassie, stereotypical, isn't it?). My human relationships haven't been so good. My family moved around a lot and my parents emphasized "family is more important than friends". I've moved like 20 times. It sucked. I do have a few good friends, mostly nerdy or in the furry fandom.
As far as being a zoophile, my best advice is "be patient". It takes a while. I'm freakin' 30. Young people are starting to piss me off. (just kidding) As far as living with your parents, you are not alone. Due to the problematic economy, many college graduates (including myself) have had to return to their parents' house. Don't feel bad about this.
Right now, I'm waiting for Minecraft 1.9. They better hurry up.
One minor point of disagreement with electricfoxx here, about therapy. There are a lot of different experiences with it in the zoo community, and to a large degree it depends on the person giving the therapy whether or not it's a good idea to tell them about it. Some are going to ignore it entirely, or worse might deem you unstable because of it. But my own experiences with it have been neutral to positive.
For example, I was seeing a therapist a few years ago to deal with family issues and emotional stuff (depression, mostly). I didn't want to say anything at first, but over time I learned to trust her and appreciate her advice. When, several years later, I could no longer handle being a zoo without telling someone, I told her in writing. She read over it, had to think about it, and while I can't say she approved overall, she was of the opinion that if I didn't harm anyone, there wasn't any real problem with that itself. Actually, that's the way the DSM V describes them too.
My point is, not all therapists will be unhelpful. Be safe and be careful, but if you want to talk to someone who isn't already a zoo supporter from online, a therapist is a decent place to start. So is a trusted friend, if you can stand it.
I know I've found it immensely freeing being able to talk candidly to friends about my attractions. Don't get me wrong, telling a friend can be incredibly hard--I think it's one of the hardest things I've ever done--but it can be worth it. Three years ago, I hadn't told a single soul, but now I require the use of both hands to count the number of people I've told. One of them, currently one of my roommates at college, has become one of my closest friends, and, though not a zoo himself, he does a good job trying to understand, and he's stood by me through many ups and downs. Like Kynophile said, though, be careful.
Welcome to the community. We are here to help, thank you for posting here.
Before I say anything, let me offer you emergency support. If you feel you're going to take your own life, please call your local crisis hotline: if you are American, select your state, and if you're from elsewhere, select your country.
As someone who also deals with anxiety, I'd like to offer you a perspective. People will say things on the internet with far less consideration or tact than they would in real life. People do not think that zoos will go away, but they are abusive because they are compelled to be so. We zoophiles place a lot of significance on their words, but in five minutes after posting an insensitive comment, they've forgotten about us.
In reality, most people do not care about anyone other than their friends and family. The hurtful comments they make, that can be painful to zoos, are made with no waste of time and given no thought at all. Most of them have no idea at all the effects their words can have on people like you and I. I know it is difficult, but you should practise paying their comments as little mind they are dealt with.
You see, we have communities (and they don't require inverted commas) to come together and support one another. Here, you can talk openly. You're correct that being a zoo is not a choice, and yet it is hard. It may seem unfair that we should have to live this way, but it is a destructive pattern of thinking to dwell on what we cannot change.
Instead, try to imagine, with me, how having a partner would feel. You see, all we can change is our perception of the world. I'm not sure which animals you find attractive, but imagine a warm summer evening with your future mate. Imagine being alone with them, and letting the burden melt away as you hold them close to you. You'd love each other. I would argue that love is the most powerful feeling we know.
And so, in that moment, you wouldn't need to shout out injustices to your parents and friends, and reveal everything about yourself, because your partner would already understand. You could come to these zoo communities and discuss your troubles. Perhaps, after some time and courage you could meet some zoos in real life, and openly discuss things. How liberating it would be! Perhaps you'd even meet a friend, or more, who you could confide in and share the part of yourself that you wish you could express.
So, right now, please, hold on. Things always get better. I would suggest seeing a reputable psychologist; you don't have to reveal your zoophilic side at first, or at all. Trust me that your future will be better than your present. Also, you are always welcome here.
Thank you for the reply, but...
I don't agree with this. In my experience (outside of the internet), a lot of people are quite genuinely thoughtful. I'm not going to take terrible things that strangers on the internet say to heart, but I can't help but be affected by them, and I don't think casting them away with a sweeping generalization like that is right.
That fantasy is appealing, but I don't want to idealize things. Dogs are great (I like dogs, by the way), but I can't have a conversation with them about philosophy or play video games with them (it would be too one-sided).
Thank you for the welcome, and for sharing with me your thoughts.
I wasn't expecting such a scientific approach. Good on you, I'll shift my tone.
That's true, but it doesn't negate what I was saying, since I was talking in terms of people on the internet alone. People in real life do seem more thoughtful and giving, just as they are far less likely to give an empty insult.
Perhaps sweeping them away isn't what you wish to do, but what else can you do with nonconstructive criticism? When somebody is plainly abusive and insulting in an unintelligent way, you can't argue with them, or discuss things with civility, because in making their comment they've made up their mind. I would never suggest dismissing someone looking to make a rational anti-zoo argument, for example.
That's true, however, doesn't that lie outside your main troubles? I wasn't saying that you should forego human contact, just that it's far easier to accept hateful comments and a lack of acceptance when you have love to concern yourself with.
The point I was loosely making was that zoophiles cannot be hedonists. We must appreciate life's small precious moments and hold them close, because life is rarely ideal for us, which is something that simply has to be accepted. We're destined to suffer, and we cope through the limited redemption of our love.
It's also worth saying that there are non-zoos who are accepting. You can have philosophical conversations with such people without fear of their judgement. A couple of real-life friends know about my feelings for animals, and they're supportive. Such people aren't hard to find, but that doesn't make telling them any less nerve-wracking.
I guess my point with that paragraph was simply to express how it felt, I wasn't really saying that there was anything I should have done about it, I was just expressing my feelings.
I'm less concerned about the individual who is mean, and more concerned with how the zeitgeist is generally against zoophiles such that perfectly reasonable people on the sidelines will just nod their heads and go along with it. I can't think of many groups whom it is more politically correct to hate.
That's true. Forgive me, I was a bit presumptuous, wasn't I?
That is a little surprising to me, but reassuring to hear.
That's understandable, but bear in mind the danger of resenting what cannot be changed. Granted, there are some zoo groups currently trying to alter the status quo, but progress is, in my opinion, unlikely to be made in our lifetimes. That's why I stressed the importance of personal happiness, but you can disagree. Most do.
If it gives you agency, it may make you feel better to do some anonymous pro-zoo work. Many zoos do, for a time, because having something to fight for and focus on gives them meaning.
No no, no hard feelings.
I want to talk to a psychologist at some point (carefully), but I think I want to get independent first. I don't want to drag anyone else into it.
waiting for "some day" can postpone things for way longer than you expected/intended. as someone who keeps waiting for the opportune time to have an animal partner of my own (i've been doing that for over a decade and a half), i feel i'm speaking from experience.
i know you don't want to keep two secrets; you'd rather only keep one. this may be an instance, however, where the greater good (i.e. keeping yourself sane and alive) is a significantly better path despite the negative(s).
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not sure exactly what to say here (that hasn't already been said more eloquently than i could) other than to be another voice of support.
i will say a few things, though. i hope you choose to stay here and talk to others. it can be very, very therapeutic to hear from others, both those who are in the exact same situation you are (someone who understands perhaps better than zoophiles who've gotten past the troubling times you're currently going through), and those who are further along (people who seem to have enough of their life in order as to be happy; something to look forward to).
you said you've checked out other communities as well. it sounds like beastforum may have been one of them. you probably figured it out already, but .. avoid that place like the plague. they are not a good representation of zoophilia, of people who actually care about their animal partners. there may be a few buried in there somewhere, but it has to be a small portion. you're better off at someplace like knotty.me , or perhaps someplace with a bit more traffic (and a chat room), like zoophilesforum.
so .. hopefully if you do choose to wait to see a psychiatrist, you can find some help here and/or elsewhere in talking to other zoophiles. i'm not surprised to see so few responses to your post at /r/SuicideWatch, sadly. i don't think people know how to treat a situation like this where they're uncomfortable with the subject matter but don't want you to kill yourself, either.
anyway, i hope you're feeling a little better/more hopeful about your chances of making it through all of this intact (mentally and physically). say it with me .. "it gets better."
Discovering that I have zoophilic feelings really threw me for a loop and changed me, so I can relate to how stressful it can feel.
But because I spend far more time working with animals than browsing the internet and seeing the vitriol and garbage that people spout and post, and I have a lot of responsibility to the care and well being of my wards, I was never quite as conflicted as others about issues like consent and if it's right or wrong.
When you're around animals, farms, and the people who care for... and all too often, mistreat their animals, you quickly realize that sexual intimacy with a beloved dog or horse is probably the best thing that we could be feeling towards these creatures that we claim to respect and care for. I've seen things that people do to their animals that rend my heart and keep me up at night. You are absolutely correct about the conditions with breeders and livestock and even just basic rednecks who live out in the boonies and won't hesitate to maim or kill their own dogs because they barked all night and woke their owners up. I wish people loved their animals the way we can sometimes love each other. I wish people would strive to connect with other creatures as closely as most zoophiles do. I've spent years on a professional level with animals, and in my professional opinion I wish there were more people who felt the way you do.
Your post is beautiful on many levels, and absolutely correct on all points, with the exception that you're carrying this burden by yourself and it's hurting you. You need to look forward to the future and don't let the present moment suck you down.
Aim towards goals in your life. Get some therapy, get some direction towards living a life where you can love and feel what you want with who or what you want without judgement. There has been no better time in all of history to be a zoophile, with communities of people who you can talk to and learn from and lean on. In most places in the world you can aim for and achieve having a life where you can be close to animals and nurture those feelings of love you have. Those feelings are not wrong. Again, I wish more people nurtured love.
It's funny, I used to be conservative, like most people who were born and raised in a lifestyle of caring for livestock, raising animals, living on the edges of town, etc. Then when I realized that I can have these amazing feelings towards non-human entities, that it's a real thing, that love trumps everything we think we know about the world, it changed me to the core. I suddenly found myself watching the debate about equality with tears in my eyes for people being persecuted just because they love each other. I suddenly realized how deeply important it is for all of us to love each other. More important than anything else you will ever do in your life. Zoophilia, or even the idea of it, made me a better person. Let it make you a better person to in whatever ways you allow it to.
You won't be alone with it forever, there are plenty of people who are accepting of it, and I found that later in life, depending on how balanced you can keep your personality, if you don't become an unwashed hermit with strange compulsions, as long as you're a passionate and caring person, people are far more accepting of whatever quirks you have, or are even open to learning about your feelings on things that may have been far more controversial when you're younger. Give this time and work on trying to find things in your life that you're proud of about yourself.* It will be okay*. You are more than okay, you're awesome. Your awesomeness oozes from your writing and your passion. I promise you, you're going to have a much better life than you can imagine.
Coming to the conclusion that it's okay to be a zoophile has really changed me. Just in two days, I can feel it.
Before, I was afraid to critically examine myself and my sexuality. The idea that zoophilia itself was wrong and corrupting had embedded itself so deeply in my brain that being a good or moral person (by the standards I'd been applying) seemed impossible, so I gave up on being constructively self-critical in respect to my sexuality.
Now that I've gotten my thoughts and feeling straightened out in text and I can concretely separate "being immoral" from "being a zoophile," I can bring myself to examine who I am. I've discovered I'm actually a tender and sensitive person who had become so swamped with cognitive dissonance that I could no longer be plain with myself about my sexuality, or effective in managing it.
I've decided to get away from the porn sites, not because of the zoophilic content, but because of the bad content. I'm going to focus on becoming independent and successful in the short term. Maybe one day I'll get a dog, and in developing the relationship I'll follow my intuition, which I now feel I can safely trust again; I could never hurt an animal. I can't even kill spiders. At some point, between conflating zoophilia with depravity and struggling to categorize myself, I forgot that about myself.
nailed it. Once you get this kind of perspective on being a zoo its a lot easier to live with yourself. I still had a bit of time after I had this kind of epiphany before I was fully happy with myself but I remember this kind of moment for me was the turning point.
I am a non-zoo and I would like to say I see nothing wrong in the way of your thinking. I would also like to say long distance friends can be just as good as in person friends and even better in some ways. I am assuming most everything else was already said in the 17 comments here, but if you ever need somebody to vent/chat/rant/etc to, feel free to send me a PM. I am easy to be friends with, so just say whatever needs to be said. I hope you are doing well and I am glad you have been able to come to terms with your sexuality.