Disclaimer: Though a bit sad, this story is in no way at all dramatic. If you're expecting something exciting, you will be very disappointed.
So, I've got a friend. Let's call him Hector.
Hector and I have been friends for a while, having met on an online game. Part of the same clan. I quit the game, and we fell out of touch for a while, though eventually we reconnected. With the direction that the conversation headed, I mentioned some of the stories I've written, and he wanted to take a look.
This is surprising because of the nature of the stories: erotic zoo stories (of a sort). I had no idea prior to this that he had any sort of interest in that sort of thing, so it was a pretty big coincidence. More than that, we also started sharing some NSFW art, again, generally of a fairly "zoo" theme (feral animals).
Still, I never really had a clear read on him. He doesn't have much interest in humans, doesn't have much interest in romantic relationships as a whole, but has expressed conflicting feelings about nonhuman animals. He also doesn't consider himself a zoophile.
This has been going on for quite a while, with a whole bunch of conflicts in his views. Hector even commissioned some stories from me. I wasn't sure what to make of that, given what he'd said at other points.
Anyway, I got the full story recently. Apparently, in the past, he did have two relationships that he considered strongly emotional and even romantic - one with a bird, and one with a chameleon, both of which he seemed to really care about. But, as these things happen, with the short lifespans of nonhumans, they passed away. Which was distressing enough that he swore off of relationships as a whole - better to never feel that pain again, in his mind.
There really isn't anything I can say to that, but it makes me really sad. He's fairly young (in his 20s)... I don't really have any real reason for sharing this, other than it resonated with me, and I wanted to get it off my chest a bit. I don't know. I wish there was something I could say that would help, but... Really not much you can say to that.
I'm glad you shared this here. Thank you ❤️🐾
Why should this belong here?
loss is universal, but in general, more frequent for zoophiles. this is totally on topic, IMO.
[deleted]
thats basically what i said. am i missing something here? i was simply trying to point out to /u/NilsP-sw that this post belongs here even though (s)he didn't seem to think so.
His romantic relationships were with animals. He's also attracted to animals. This is an issue which frequently affects zoophiles. How would it not belong here?
IDK...zoophilia is defined as "sexual AND emotional attraction towards animals". Whenever such a story that clearly lacks a sexual component arises, I´m sorry to say I cannot see anything different in it than in "normal" pet ownership. Any animal owner feels the same, goes through the same when his beloved animal dies...to postulate any form of zoophilia here is quite audacious.
Maybe I didn't make this clear enough.
He is clearly sexually attracted to animals. He paid me to write him an erotic story about animals, and he frequently shows interest in NSFW art of animals (particularly horses).
Regardless of whether he identifies himself as a zoophile, he fits both your criteria of sexual and emotional attraction towards animals, so I don't see how it is an audacious claim in the slightest.
Even by your own restrictive definition of zoophile, 30-30, which excludes anyone who has an interest in humans, he would seem to fit, considering he is not attracted to humans.
No, you didn´t make it clear, thus my reply.
Why are you so sure about his sexual attractions? Has he told you? Or do you conclude this solely from his interest in NSFW art in word and picture? Why are you so sure although he not even himself calls himself a zoophile?
Look, I know how seductive it is to see "zoos" everywhere because that can give you a feeling of not being a tiny minority, but I think you are jumping to conclusions too quick. He wouldn´t be the first shy and inward guy to fantasize about animals , but never had, has or will have the "real deal" of actual experience. As with falling in love with your teacher or some random popstar, the really intriguing thing about this kind of "zoophilia" is that it never will be anywhere near "real" and you never have to put yourself to the test. He had "relationships" to a bird and a reptile, so the sexual component just isn´t there no matter how hard you want to talk it into this debate.
I´m still not convinced of anything you claim about another person...why not recommend this sub to him, invite him to join and let him speak for himself, huh?
Yes.
You can definitely have non-harmful sexual contact with birds and reptiles... just sayin'.
I can attest to this. I had a pet bird who would frequently masturbate against my feet. He liked socks a lot.
He enjoyed himself, so I didn't see any reason to stop him, even though I got nothing out of it. I imagine someone else could have enjoyed such contact, and even encouraged it.
Richard Stallman (Free Software Foundation President) admits to such contact with his parrot:
https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxmemes/comments/4fpn9s/til_richard_stallman_had_sex_with_a_parrot/
Maybe they don't want to shrivel up in a proverbial lake Assal. Or perhaps they don't personally want to talk about it to strangers on the internet. Swibblestein gains nothing from trying to fabricate a story here, unless you want to argue that he wanted ten karma to add to his 13,000 existing karma.
It isn´t about making up a story for whatever reason...it´s about not making wild assumptions with no basis. Forcing someone to come out is never a good thing, even with good intent behind it. Leave people alone and wait until THEY see fit to tell what they "are". What also nags me about Swibblestein´s post is the obvious underlying wish I described in my reply, namely that of increasing "our "numbers artificially so you don´t feel "alone" in your rather uncommon orientation/fetish/kink/whatever.
As I understand it, he was explicitly told much of what he wrote here.
I'm not sure where this fits into swibblestein's post, nor why it should matter here. It's an earnest retelling of events with no exceedingly sensitive content to speak of, nor any overt assertions about the subject. Even if this hector appeared in the community tomorrow, we'd be none the wiser... so saying that posting a short story of past events is them 'forcing them to come out' seems like a stretch.
Sexually attracted to chameleons and birds? if not, then his connection to them is not that of a zoosexual but that of a pet owner.
I won't say that you post doesn't belong in this forum. I can see it as nice topic to discus, but you could perfectly post this in a pets forum and get the same help or better help (as you would avoid unnecessary rants about him being or not being a zoo)
them feels. :(
I think some of that is normal, I know when I lost my first love, it shook me up and I kept telling myself that I was done; I'd simply live alone rather than expose myself to that pain again. Eventually I realized that while the end is extremely distressing, the quality of all the other days are part of it too. My happiness and the quality of my life is greatly enhanced when it's shared, so I accept that this is just part of the process. To experience the good days I have to accept that there will be some horrific days when I'd rather just curl up and die.
I did the same thing, when I lost Tippy. In my opinion there isn't really anything you can say. The pain has to heal on it's own, and he has to come to the realization that a relationship ending in death does not mean forever, if he ever does.
The pressure folks put on me to find another love drove me to not even try, and to ignore the love that was there before me for years. You really can't change someones mind on that, only make it worse.
The best you can do is try to remain a friend, and try to understand him, and he will (hopefully) come around in his own time.
silverwolf
I haven't been pressuring him to try a relationship, because I think that's a rude thing to do in general.
The one thing I have tried to pressure him to do is to be more open with himself about his feelings, though I don't pressure him heavily or anything. I think he's in a weird state of denial and rejection of certain aspects and I don't think that's healthy.
This story has two aspects that call out to this community, EOL issues and "practising" vs "romantic" Zoos.
Two different species are almost never going to have identical lifespans or progression of ageing. If you are bonded and either of you die or become incapacitated, someone is going to get hurt. When we are young, it's going to be the human surviving and suffering. When we are old, the situation reverses.
I would suggest just being there for him. Hang around for the time (and it will come) that he chooses to get back into life. The pain never entirely passes but it does fade into the distance as time marches on. One of the perks of being old is being able to say things like that with certainty.
The other question is trickier. Is he really "Zoo" if he can't have sex with the animal that he is bonded with? I know of a number of youngsters dreaming of horses but unable to keep one. They often bond with school or nearby animals but cannot consummate the relationship. So they cannot be Zoo until they either fencehop or get wealthy? And even worse, what about the 'phin lovers?
I think we need to limit "exclusive" to individual tastes and make community more "inclusive". We don't need every fetish seeker out there but there are quite a few youngsters that began with bestiality and grew into zoophilia as the years went by.
This guy sounds like a typical youngster floundering around trying to understand a part of himself that society denies even exists. I too would recommend inviting him here. I understand that leaves you with some tough choices re self outing but it sounds too late for most of those worries.
It bugs me apparently some folks think you can't be zoo without sexual attraction, or sex at all (like you said, if they're unable to have it). I'm not sexually attracted to my partner's species actually, but it's definitely romantic (much different than my feelings towards my other pets, of which I have many!). And even if I was attracted to her she's not interested in anything sexual anyway.
I've heard from multiple others who have romantic attraction to an animal but not sexual attraction. That can happen in humans too and imo pretty much any variation of human sexuality can also happen within zoosexuality. As long as they can tell there's a distinction between their romantic feelings and a normal pet/owner relationship (or maybe idealization of the animal?) I don't think we should consider those people "less zoo" or "not zoo."
Sorry I got on a tangent there not quite related to your comment lol. Attraction aside, you can definitely be zoo without having sex (for whatever reason that may be) and it really surprises me that there are folks who think you're not zoo for sure until you do!
Romantic and emotional attractions are definitely different things. It's pretty obvious when you look at humans. A "boyfriend" or a "girlfriend" is treated differently from just a regular friend, even if there is no sex going on. I think it's odd that some people don't recognize the distinction.
I also agree that you can be a zoo without having actually done anything - heck, even if you intend to never have any such contact.
I have been lobbying for a different definition for years but there's just too much confusion already to get much traction. My preferred version: Anyone who values another species' life or emotions as at least equal to their own. Notice that works both ways.
One of the requirement for sexual orientation is to have sexual traction for what ever thing or being that you are sexually oriented.
If you don't have a sexual attraction for that animal (you don't get aroused by them, have sexual fantasies about them) then you are not a zoosexual. You are just some one who really loves that animal. Like an over the top pet lover, not a zoosexual.
This is why some one who really loves his mom or biological children over anyone else is not a incestosexual or pedosexual.
There is a difference between loving an animal and not being sexually attracted to them and loving an animal and not being able to have sex with them (while wanting to have it at least in fantasy) because of moral or physical or location incompatibilities.
And such humans don't have a sexual orientation for humans. I don't know what they have, but is certainty not a sexual origination as they don't fit the broad definition of sexual orientation.
And yes, you can be a zoosexual without sex, as long as you wish or fantasy to have zoosex.
I quit having fish as pets because of emotional distress from their deaths. I love them as pets.
Your friend, may be some one with a strong connection to pets, not of the same kind as a zoosexual but different. More like a mom with their babies type connection.